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Pogoplug V3 OXNAS - USB 3.0 on mPCIe - Thread 1

Posted by bodhi 
Pogoplug V3 OXNAS - USB 3.0 on mPCIe - Thread 1
November 21, 2016 04:41PM
@Gravelrash,

Bingo, that was it, FDD. Thanks!

@Joey,

Quote

That's why in theory I think PogoPro's mpcie-to-USB3.0 card may not need power if it has a powered USB 3.0 hub plugged into it. The kind that use a wall wart 5v power supply

This is true. I am certain it would work with a power USB hub. And it is not bad. Later, we can always jiggy up the power with this cable you found: http://www.ebay.com/itm/322323636200


So I bought:

mPCIe:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/131871426741

and both USB 3.0 connectors (in case I want to squeeze them inside the case).:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/232075851298
http://www.ebay.com/itm/232075851720

I am most interested in seeing if this full-height Renesas based card work in the iConnect and Pogo Pro:

Quote

Based on Renesas D720202 chipset USB 3.0 Host Controller IC

I gave up on looking for the half-height card, I don't think we can find it.

-bodhi
===========================
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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/14/2017 06:21AM by bodhi.
Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
November 21, 2016 09:33PM
bodhi Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
Well congratulations getting to it first. I'd imagine you have a fast desktop to copy over for tests? I ask because of my first Pogoplug transfer tests - a USB 2.0 stick at the Pogo end and another USB 2.0 stick at the ThinClient end, and I wondered why it was going slow... doh lol


-edited- I realized something else, that if (I'm big on contingency planning) there was any slowness due to chipset bottleneck on the Pogo, one alternative would be to run one of each, an external hard drive and Gigabit to USB 3 and see if the unit does the processing within itself. This is sort of a built-in hedge of performance protection. But it the unit communicates to Pogo's own Gigabit, go with two external hard drives.

Has it arrived yet Bodhi? LOL

Okay, here's a good question: let's say USB 3.0 works fine on two ports, and SATA is also working with one big drive. What is the storage limits running Debian on this device?

(this is INSANE! - wonders never cease around here)

=========
-=Cloud 9=-



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/22/2016 12:53AM by JoeyPogoPlugE02.
Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
November 22, 2016 01:22AM
Joey,

> -edited- I realized something else, that if
> (I'm big on contingency planning) there was any
> slowness due to chipset bottleneck on the Pogo,
> one alternative would be to run one of each, an
> external hard drive and Gigabit to USB 3 and see
> if the unit does the processing within itself.
> This is sort of a built-in hedge of performance
> protection.
> But it the unit communicates to Pogo's
> own Gigabit, go with two external hard drives.

Not sure I understand this. IIRC, on the Pogo Pro, Gigabit NIC, SATA, and PCIe are all separated from each other. I could be wrong, though.


> Okay, here's a good question: let's say USB 3.0
> works fine on two ports, and SATA is also working
> with one big drive. What is the storage limits
> running Debian on this device?

No limit other than the storage limit of that HDD. I don't think there is SATA port multiplier (that's why I think with port multiplier, the GoFlex Home and Net plugs are really good for the (old) price of $US 20-30).

-bodhi
===========================
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Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
November 22, 2016 08:17AM
bodhi Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Not sure I understand this. IIRC, on the Pogo Pro,
> Gigabit NIC, SATA, and PCIe are all separated from
> each other. I could be wrong, though.

You are correct - the devices are all on separate bus.
Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
November 22, 2016 05:28PM
Gravelrash Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> bodhi Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Not sure I understand this. IIRC, on the Pogo
> Pro,
> > Gigabit NIC, SATA, and PCIe are all separated
> from
> > each other. I could be wrong, though.
>
> You are correct - the devices are all on separate
> bus.

I thought so. So I am not sure I understood what Joey question is about?

-bodhi
===========================
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Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
November 22, 2016 08:54PM
bodhi Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I thought so. So I am not sure I understood what
> Joey question is about?

It had to do with SATA access speed of Pogoplug Pro v3, where the SATA drive access was okay but not the SATA II speeds other computers can wrangle out of the same hard drive considering Gigabit connection. No problem for several reasons. But the Pogo 4 that accomodates SATA II and USB 3.0, that too wasn't known to be especially fast. Now if we're seeding torrents over a connection slower than that, or streaming music to one of those $6 FM transmitters, no problem.

Let's say we've got USB 3.0 on a Pogo Pro and an external hard drive is plugged-in. Great, I for one have a LOT of work to do editing my files on the hard drive, rendering, lots of stuff. And I can do this over LAN with any computer around here.

All I'm saying, is if for any reason there is a bottleneck and you're getting 30MB/sec when reading the hard drive, maybe another option would be to use a different ethernet adapter in one of the USB 3.0 jacks.

But I suspect processing in the middle so maybe it'd be the same.

I'm really excited about the prospects and implications, but at the moment have to take care of certain needs than uncertain experiments.

=========
-=Cloud 9=-



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/22/2016 09:22PM by JoeyPogoPlugE02.
Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
November 22, 2016 09:47PM
JoeyPogoPlugE02 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> bodhi Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I thought so. So I am not sure I understood
> what
> > Joey question is about?
>
> It had to do with SATA access speed of Pogoplug
> Pro v3, where the SATA drive access was okay but
> not the SATA II speeds other computers can wrangle
> out of the same hard drive considering Gigabit
> connection. No problem for several reasons. But
> the Pogo 4 that accomodates SATA II and USB 3.0,
> that too wasn't known to be especially fast. Now
> if we're seeding torrents over a connection slower
> than that, or streaming music to one of those $6
> FM transmitters, no problem.
>
> Let's say we've got USB 3.0 on a Pogo Pro and an
> external hard drive is plugged-in. Great, I for
> one have a LOT of work to do editing my files on
> the hard drive, rendering, lots of stuff. And I
> can do this over LAN with any computer around
> here.
>
> All I'm saying, is if for any reason there is a
> bottleneck and you're getting 30MB/sec when
> reading the hard drive,

That is only when you have not tuned the system.

> maybe another option would
> be to use a different ethernet adapter in one of
> the USB 3.0 jacks.
>

With Gbits, I'd expect both SATA and USB 3.0 HDD will reach 80-100 MB/s with NFS and Samba.


> But I suspect processing in the middle so maybe
> it'd be the same.
>
> I'm really excited about the prospects and
> implications, but at the moment have to take care
> of certain needs than uncertain experiments.

Yeah, I know. I dont have the need for speed so I left the tuning part to others. I've been streaming HD 1080p videos that are served by Goflex Home HDD for years without problem so I never bother to seriously look into tuning the rootfs.

-bodhi
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Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
February 06, 2017 02:32PM
Quote


mPCIe:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/131871426741


I am most interested in seeing if this full-height Renesas based card work in the iConnect and Pogo Pro:

Quote

Based on Renesas D720202 chipset USB 3.0 Host Controller IC

This card is available again on eBay. Thanks Joey!

-bodhi
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Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
February 14, 2017 05:25PM
bodhi Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This card is available again on eBay. Thanks Joey!

Prodigal son here after squandering previous pennies to a TV antenna/box that doesn't work in this country (*ouch*)

Finally I was able to order that part, as well as this header/connector. So if anyone else is interested, St Patrick's Day storm project later in the winter, order now! Just think, if this could make external hard drives go at merely twice the speed of USB 2.0, how much more fun this would be and how inexpensive to run at less wattage than a bathroom night light?

Don't get me wrong, if your streaming needs are met, then I don't wish to persuade you from your piggy bank.
The FDD to molex adapter (for power) is 2 for 99 cents, and the USB to molex is about $1.29. So I'll attempt to power my USB 3.0 from an existing USB 2 port on the Pogo Pro.

So if I'm not the only one who sees investment brilliance in this $12 Valentine's Day present for your Pogoplug Pro, pull the trigger! :-)

=========
-=Cloud 9=-



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/14/2017 07:26PM by JoeyPogoPlugE02.
Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
February 15, 2017 12:37AM
Joey,

Thank you. Those are really good deals!
Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
February 15, 2017 02:48AM
Joey,

I'll build a new kernel for this. I'm getting really busy atm, but I can certainly spend a few minutes get it ready for you to test :)

-bodhi
===========================
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Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
February 15, 2017 06:15PM
bodhi Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Joey,
>
> I'll build a new kernel for this. I'm getting real
> ly busy atm, but I can certainly spend a few minut
> es get it ready for you to test :)

I offered Habibie my FM/TV box if he gets on board; the more group effort the merrier.
This will answer persistent questions whether PogoPros will allow USB 3.0 to do what lack of Port Multiplication would have helped SATA drives for a great NAS. Furthermore if I saw 80MB/sec read speeds over Gigabit LAN I'd be able to pity WD book. And it's fairly certain this would allow copying of externals at very high speeds, but the question remains if it can make it to Ethernet so fast.

Real big thanks to you bodhi, and certainly no hurry; that' s an understatement. I wonder if arrival dates are based on a stowaway on a banana boat or something lol

=========
-=Cloud 9=-
Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
February 15, 2017 06:47PM
Joey,

Quote

The FDD to molex adapter (for power) is 2 for 99 cents, and the USB to molex is about $1.29. So I'll attempt to power my USB 3.0 from an existing USB 2 port on the Pogo Pro.

What is the typical pin out for the FD header? will those 4 pins on the mPCIe card match what provide by this USB-Molex --> Molex-FD combo?

-bodhi
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Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
February 15, 2017 07:07PM
bodhi Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Joey,
>
>
Quote

The FDD to molex adapter (for power) is 2 f
> or 99 cents, and the USB to molex is about $1.29.
> So I'll attempt to power my USB 3.0 from an existi
> ng USB 2 port on the Pogo Pro.
>
> What is the typical pin out for the FD header? wil
> l those 4 pins on the mPCIe card match what provid
> e by this USB-Molex --> Molex-FD combo?

I believe all we need is 5 volts for the mpcie card, which means snipping the yellow and black next to it off, to be on the safe side. The reason is because of the three other USB 3.0 units here, one of which is for a laptop's PCIE port. And yes the Molex will line up what's right. I soldered my own USB to molex with just the 5 volts and it works fine, powers the hard drive on the thin client I'm typing n now :-)

So I'm quite confident based on my own experience as well as realizing this is designed for a laptop-type thing, where 12 volts would be fairly unavailable. But which pins carry the 5 volts in order to be sure? Worse comes to worse I can take a picture when I sort it, in fact no trouble to try this in my headless laptop first. But I have yet to see a USB 3.0 device that needs 12v, including hubs.

=========
-=Cloud 9=-
Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
February 15, 2017 07:21PM
Hi Joey,

>. But which pins carry the 5 volts in order t
> o be sure? Worse comes to worse I can take a pictu
> re when I sort it, in fact no trouble to try this
> in my headless laptop first. But I have yet to see
> a USB 3.0 device that needs 12v, including hubs.

The output of USB 3.0 port is 5V. So it is pretty safe. I'm just wondering what the pinout of these connectors and if they match one end to the other without modified. Can you list the pins for each wire connector in this rig, what are the 1 2 3 4 ?

USB --> Molex: 1 2 3 4

Molex: 1 2 3 4 --> FD: 1 2 3 4

-bodhi
===========================
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Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
February 15, 2017 09:56PM
bodhi Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
Can you list the pins for each w
> ire connector in this rig, what are the 1 2 3 4 ?
> USB --> Molex: 1 2 3 4
> Molex: 1 2 3 4 --> FD: 1 2 3 4

As we can see below, the wire colors stay the same, although our FDD receptacle is female and therefore pin order is backwards below although correct, right?

Molex 4 pin Peripheral Power Connector Pinout (ATX v2.2)
Pin Name Color Description
1 +12VDC Yellow +12 VDC
2 COM Black Ground
3 COM Black Ground
4 +5VDC Red +5 VDC

Floppy Drive 4 pin Power Connector Pinout (ATX v2.2)
Pin Name Color Description
1 +5VDC Red +5 VDC
2 COM Black Ground
3 COM Black Ground
4 +12VDC Yellow +12 VDC

Source:

* in other words, when I look at the connectors (knowing the molex part lacks any 12 volt + gnd line), and eye the colors on the FDD-to-molex adapter, the colors line up and it's only a matter which way the plug goes on the mpcie card. I might ask seller what the pinout is.

=========
-=Cloud 9=-



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/15/2017 10:01PM by JoeyPogoPlugE02.
Re: Best Pogoplug to buy
February 15, 2017 11:52PM
Cool! that what I was looking for :) So if the card FD male header follows the standard, then it should match up with our female FD connector.

-bodhi
===========================
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